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To introduce Carl Schwan. He's going to be talking to us about the KDE apps initiative.

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CARL SCHWANNENBACHER- OK, yeah. Well, actually, I won't talk exactly about KDE

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apps initiative because there's no goal, which does almost the same thing.

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So there's no point to have an initiative and a goal at the same time.

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But I will still talk about the app ecosystem, the KDE app ecosystem,

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and what we can do to make data, to improve it, and the current state of it.

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Oh, no, it's like the sun is split up.

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Okay, so a bit about me. I've been contributing for a long time. I started in 2018.

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I've evolved in many, many apps.

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I love apps. So like, for example, NeoChat, Tokodon, Macro, Caligra,

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Contrast, Coco, and a lot, lot more.

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I mean, this is mostly like a lot evolved, and there's also a lot of applications

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where I'm a bit less involved, but still involved.

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And maintaining key gaming add-ons, and a lot of our part of the infrastructure

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for the AppleApps.key.org to do a bit of promotion for apps.

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Yeah. Yeah, so let's talk a bit about what is an application ecosystem.

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I try to find some definition on the internet, but there is not one definition.

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There is multiple keywords, which might be interesting to talk about.

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It's inspired by natural ecosystem, like with multiple actors,

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and which are a bit of a relationship between each of us.

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And I think that's, yeah. And there's a bit of scalability, You cannot go alone,

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you need many actors in the system to grow and to, um,

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uh, uh, the ability, which is as a related, like alone, you cannot create an

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application ecosystem.

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You need many people, many different companies, uh, just hobbies.

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It needs to be like many different things. things, and this also ensures that

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the system is resilient.

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And there's also collaborations.

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You are working on the same goal together.

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But there is a bit of competition, which is also good.

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It's a healthy balance between collaboration and competition.

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You might have some multiple music applications, which all try to reach a different niche.

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And they might reuse a lot of codes.

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And also iterability, integration with APIs.

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It's also something that we have a lot in KDE. For example, if you use Caligra,

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you will be able to read your document files as in Okula because Caligra provides Okula generators.

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And we have a lot of that in KDE with Kapparts.

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And that's a good thing, I think, that each application extends each of us.

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Yeah, so my goals were to close the feature gap between proprietary application ecosystems.

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With that, I mean Windows, macOS, iOS, Android,

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they have a lot of applications, which covers many, many use cases.

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And if you want to get more users for BASMA and Linux in general,

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we need to close these gaps so that users can do the same thing that they did

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with some property systems and do that with a liberal open-source system we

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think is to close these gaps we need to increase the number of applications,

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designed for plasma and plasma mobile and this is not something we can do with

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the current number of contributors so we need to as well get more contributors.

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And, yeah, and, and as well, like increase the number of users in other platforms,

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because that's why it's cool, but we need to ensure, but as we're working on

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Gnome on Windows and macOS,

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Android, and I saw some people talking about iOS in the last few days, so yeah.

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And this also leads to increase adoption of Qt and KDE frameworks,

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which is super important for us like the more users of the frameworks we have

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the better it will become,

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yeah and but we don't only need to create new applications we have a lot of

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applications already and a lot of these applications um.

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Um i mean we have a lot of applications which are maintained well maintained

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but we as well have some applications which didn't receive

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any updates in a long time uh like some

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example like calica which i just tried to revive recently but

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carwave i mean we have a lot of or a

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lot of educational applications for example which might need

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a small push um yeah and

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the good thing is like every time we have a new application or

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we improve application to other new things we also improve

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our frameworks like i see that with for example add-ons like every time i create

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new applications or try to get involved in the new applications um it leads

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to a lot of improvements to kia add-ons which is a good thing and these improvements

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as a benefit also of our applications,

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applications, which is good. And then basically the end goal is to see the core

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of the KDE project as both in terms of applications, but as well as the community.

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Yeah. Let's look a bit at the current state. We have over 200 first-party applications. Yeah.

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And we have 60 frameworks, over 60 frameworks.

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With KF5, we had like over 80s, and had to revisit a bit the numbers.

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We get rid of a few of them, which is good because these were like all frameworks,

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which are not really maintained like HTML, like you know, you choose GitHub engine.

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And we have a really good set of adoption of KF6 and KDE, KDE 6 and KDE 6 in KDE.

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We see like a few applications using KDE 5, five, but we managed in a really

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short time to migrate most of them to 3DS6, which is good.

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Yeah. But there is a bit of a negative thing, is that we only have very little

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third-party applications.

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I mean, we managed to convert every third-party application through first-party

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applications, which is in some way good.

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But we don't, outside of the KDE bubble, like the inner KDE bubbles,

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we don't see a lot of third-party applications.

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I mean, there is a few of them. We had that at a previous presentation.

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I learned a few new names, which is good.

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But even third-party applications are often maintained by KDE people.

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I mean, for work, I also have maintained two third-party CAD applications and, yeah.

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And the maintenance level of each of our, even of first-party applications,

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it really depends on the application.

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Like for example, games, well games, games are mostly done, which is good.

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So they don't need a lot of maintenance. But there's like, for example,

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education applications.

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Some of them might need a bit more maintenance.

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Yeah, and why I'm talking about that is I did this sort of graph to analyze with the KDE community.

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And we can see that we had a peak around 2012, 2014. 14 and then it go a bit

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down, go a bit up, but it's mostly stagnant.

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Um, like, and this is like the number of authors, contributors.

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Um, I also have the same thing with the number of commits, which is maybe not

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the best metrics, but still it's quite telling.

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It's mostly flat and we want to have a bit of core.

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I mean, it's still improved a bit, like, it's last few years we had a bit of

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more improvement, which is good.

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Yeah, let's talk a bit about what we have. Currently, there's always this debate

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about widgets and QdQuick.

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I think both have their place. Like, if you had talked with me like two years

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ago, I would have said let's port everything to QML.

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Meanwhile, I discovered QdWidgets because I use that for work and yeah,

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it's actually not that bad, Qt Widgets.

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There is a few things I think it's easier to do with Qt Quick and a few things

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I think is easier to do with Qt Widgets.

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We will live with both of them for a long time.

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We have a desktop bridge, a Quick Controls style bridge which fix most of the

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styling issues choose between the two worlds.

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But I still think Qt Quick is vital if you want to do mobile applications for Plasma Mobile.

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And yeah, but I mean, the thing is often like Kigami is more mobile-centric,

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and Qt Widget is more desktop-centric, and we need to try to bridge that.

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And I tried to do that with Kigami Addons. I already added a lot of features

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for doing more desktop applications,

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like a comment bar where you can find all the actions available,

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shortcut editor, and stuff like that, which are quite vital for desktop applications,

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for getting really productive within applications.

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And as well, I could do a lot of more stuff for mobile, like form cards,

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who have a layout for it, which work for mobile with good enough touch surface.

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Yeah, we have a quite good CI CD in Caddy.

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It's super easy to get our applications deployed for other platforms,

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mostly thanks to the people like Volker, Ben, and Ovas, and Anna, and Julius too.

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It's really good. Like you can see, you can deploy for AppImage,

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macOS, Windows, Flatpak.

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It's quite good. We have one issue is that for continuous integrations,

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we do have a lot of platforms.

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For delivery, we are a bit less good.

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We produce packages, but we don't expose them to the users.

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We only have a few applications in the Windows Store.

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Event Talk, we have a lot of applications which compile, so Windows.

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And there's a last step which we need to finish so that our applications are deployed.

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Like on Flatpak. For Flatpak, every time we get an update,

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a few days later, one week later, we get all these updates to the users.

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And for other platforms like Windows, I had to take a look at the NeoShad version,

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but I think it's a bit outdated already in the Windows Store.

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And we need to make that a bit easier.

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Yeah, release tooling. I've been pushing a lot to move more applications to

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the release service, which is a really great thing for us to be able to release

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all of our applications all the time.

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Because we had a lot of issues with some applications that were not released for years.

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And ensuring that we get to release regularly with some bug fixes,

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some translation updates is good.

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And we need to do that more. There are some talks about modifications of the

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release cycles uh there's a buffer of that uh soon and yeah we are get we already

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got the automatic updates and we need to do that with more platforms i think

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android as well have that.

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And not just Natalie Wills. Yes, translation toolings, it's still based on SVN.

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And it's mainly based on Contribution Overflow. But for applications,

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we want applications to be translated in many languages.

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And we might want to think about how to make it easier to get more contributors in these areas.

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I tried some prototype. I mean, basically two ways to work with.

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Either we try to migrate completely to something new, like WebLates,

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or we try to build something which works with the current way.

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We are doing it, at least some prototypes with some web front-end for SVN.

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And yeah, it's some ideas that we might want to explore more.

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Yeah, user documentation. I don't know if you look at your user documentation

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for applications. applications, it's not that good. It's often really updated.

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The tooling for that is based on XML, which is not the best format if you want to get contributors to.

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And we also have some wikis which store a bit of information,

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which was basically used as a way to to do that in the wikis,

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and now we have a documentation split between two platforms.

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And the website for documentation is slightly a bit outdated.

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I mean, you can see the Caddy 4 logo there.

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Yeah, something to improve if you want to get really good applications,

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We also need sometimes to have at least a bit of documentation,

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maybe not complete manual like we used to do that, but at least a bit of documentation.

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Yeah, developer tooling. What is the set?

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Like we have a lot of developer tools in KDE, which might be explained by the

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fact that we are a lot of developers there.

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I mean like, for example, like Kate, KDEvelop, from IDE or text editors,

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Clazy to do static analysis,

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KDE source build to build all the software we want, Craft to deploy the software on many platforms.

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Ibtrack to do some memory usage analysis.

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F-Inspector to analyze the binary size of executables.

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Commit to do some git management.

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Compare to compare to display divs.

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CodeVis, to do architectural analysis of the whole software.

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You can see all the components.

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It's super fancy. It's quite new.

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CarbTemplate, to create a new application. It's like a small workflow.

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You want to start a new application, or you start it, you open CarbTemplate,

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and just take the template, and done.

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You have a basic structure of it.

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RCPT Inspector, if you want your application to be accessible,

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So it's good to have some tooling there, too.

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And whether it's not KDE from the KDE itself, but still bit KDE related,

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GameAway and Hotspot, which were developed by KDE developers,

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and are also open source.

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And I mean, speaking of Kerab templates, the first thing that changed is that

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it's now using Kigami, which is good.

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It was completely ported to Kigami. And I started to add more examples.

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So if you want to do multimedia management applications, basically you have

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a template for that, which gives you all the basic structure to do that.

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If you want to do a video games launcher, where you can see all your video games

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and you click on it and then it launches. It's nice.

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And maybe like Swift, for example, like Apple developed a lot of Swift playgrounds,

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which is basically sort of mixed between IDE and,

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IDE and live preview with a lot of tutorials or to interactively create an application

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and learn to program with that technology.

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And maybe something we should be inspired by that.

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I mean, there's a Gnome Workbench, which is a Gnome equivalent for that.

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And I try to do, like, as a smart prototype. Like, you see, can we do that?

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Can we do, like, some live previews? You can just edit your QML code,

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and then you see the results and then provide some examples.

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Samples, basic components of the interactive HFS.

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One issue is that the text editor is QML, which is not so good.

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So maybe it's a good idea to try to use a text editor for that instead of doing

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that in QML and just use QML for live view.

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Some ideas. Just try to explore some ideas where we could go,

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try to make it easier for people to get started with this technology.

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Yeah um like c++ i love c++ but not everyone does that and there's some inspiration about bindings,

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um there was a talk about joshua yesterday i was

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a host which i missed because i was in the other but there is also Darshan Paldesay

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who is working on some 6xQt binding space for the KDE frameworks, which is cool.

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And for Phyton, there is also talk from Christian yesterday about what they

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are doing in Qt. and we have a G-SARC project which is ending now,

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I think today is the last day,

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for doing the same thing, I mean, parasite-based bindings for the KDE framework,

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so we can also have that as an option.

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And there's maybe like other languages to consider. I mean, I think the Qt people

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are looking at C Sharp, maybe Swift, since Swift also has a good,

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Good story about C++ integrations.

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And yeah, things that we need to explore to see how people could build a new KDE application with.

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And we also need to do a bit more KDE developer outreach.

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Like we recently launched a KDE for developers web page, which is really cool.

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Thanks for everyone in the pro team for helping with that. And yeah,

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I mean, a set of marketing sites, I mean, there's a developerkit.org website,

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which is like, there's also a bit of promotion material,

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but also like a lot of documentations,

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for technical documentation about how to use KDE frameworks,

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how they interact with Qt, what features you can add to your application based on the KDE frameworks.

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I'm quite happy with that. I mean, I started to work there in 2019, I think, or 20.

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And I'm happy that I'm not doing that much anymore there. And there's new people

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going there and helping with that.

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So that's a nice project, which worked quite well, I think. Could be better,

242
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but I'm really super happy with the results there.

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I also have a mission to consider is what I do with Kigami add-ons is that every

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time I do a new release, I try to.

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What the blog post about the new features there or to use these new features with some code examples,

246
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and we should probably probably consider doing that with um the kd frameworks

247
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too because currently kd frameworks is basically just uh and that's i don't

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think anyone here with them,

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and we might want to spend a teeny bit more time to at least point out one a

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few big change a few big additions to the KDE framework so that people know about this change,

251
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and can make use of them.

252
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Because you only know about this change if you either maintain the frameworks,

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or you contribute the features.

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And yeah.

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Maybe it's a bit of effort, but I think it's worth it.

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What I've been doing a lot is to try to do social media Every time there is

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a challenge that affects developers, I try to post about it on social media.

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Mostly Macedon, because I only use Macedon, but if people use other platforms,

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they can also post there.

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Something that might be good for others to do the same.

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So, I mean, I do a lot and I'm hoping that other people could try to do more in that direction.

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Maybe we also could consider a third-party app program, a bit like Gnome Circle,

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where there's Gnome Core applications,

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which are not a lot of them, and then we have a lot of third-party applications,

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which can be used beyond GitHub, beyond the GitLab, basically basically anywhere where they want.

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And we have a few requirements, but it's less difficult to be part of the program

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than to be like a real first-party application for Gnome. And maybe we need the same thing.

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We just need to find a good name, decide on the process to add these applications

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to that program and see what advantages these applications have.

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Like, we should try to promote them, these first-party applications,

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on our official channels, even if they are not official applications.

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I've already been doing a bit of that. that, if you look at the KDE for page,

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like KDE for developers or KDE for artists or anything,

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you will always see at the bottom a list of other open source applications which

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are not KDE applications, but we recommend to users if they want to.

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I mean, that's part of the ecosystem. You don't need to promote your application.

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You will need to promote other applications to make it core.

278
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Yeah. But I think something we need to decide to, yeah.

279
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So if there are some people interested in that, let me know.

280
00:25:15,009 --> 00:25:19,729
OK. But outside of developer outreach, we also maybe want to do a bit of user

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outreach, more weekly news about applications.

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Like, currently, there's a this week in Cade thing, which mostly is about Plasma

283
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and a few selected applications, like Dolphin, Okula, Kate, which is,

284
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I mean, it's understandable.

285
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Net doesn't have enough time and energy to do that for every application.

286
00:25:43,162 --> 00:25:47,842
Okay, it's not Plasma. No, only Plasma. Okay. But yeah, we might need to do

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something for applications and spread the workload.

288
00:25:52,222 --> 00:25:55,982
It's a thing. It shouldn't not only be Net or me.

289
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It should be like a community thing with a group of people taking responsibility for that.

290
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And yeah. And maybe we should adopt something like TGP matrix or TGP sync norm

291
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where it's basically every developers which post their update on that blog post

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which is like maybe like two lines of text was that enough and as maybe social

293
00:26:17,762 --> 00:26:20,382
medias to try to promote our applications,

294
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more there or maybe probably both actually like we should probably do both and

295
00:26:27,282 --> 00:26:32,442
go in a bit of every direction and see which what works most and what works

296
00:26:32,442 --> 00:26:35,602
less yeah i mean like for example for the social media,

297
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created that my personal account,

298
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which post, I mean, the idea was to post regularly about new applications.

299
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Uh, for the moment I only did that once, but there's some post plant.

300
00:26:47,542 --> 00:26:53,542
I mean, I really like, uh, just like promote like bit of more niche applications,

301
00:26:53,842 --> 00:26:59,582
like Ktorrent, um, which is like one of the big KDE applications,

302
00:27:00,142 --> 00:27:01,962
but it's actually super powerful.

303
00:27:01,962 --> 00:27:06,722
Like if you look at it, there's a lot of plugins where you can search for torrents

304
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with a web browser embedded. I mean, it's super powerful.

305
00:27:10,962 --> 00:27:13,022
But yeah, not many people know about it.

306
00:27:15,922 --> 00:27:26,602
Yeah yeah and also on flattop there's a quality program where applications which

307
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meet the standard requirements for

308
00:27:28,662 --> 00:27:35,282
quality are then promoted to their own homepage of flattop and i've been,

309
00:27:36,162 --> 00:27:42,502
doing a lot of polishing there towards upstream metadata um again would be nice

310
00:27:42,502 --> 00:27:44,382
if it wouldn't be only me there.

311
00:27:47,902 --> 00:27:51,822
I mean, for example, just ensuring that the screenshot is updated,

312
00:27:52,322 --> 00:27:56,702
making sure that the text is there, that we have some good information.

313
00:27:58,762 --> 00:28:03,462
It's not a lot of work, but it's 200 applications where we need to do the work,

314
00:28:03,582 --> 00:28:11,682
so if we could spread the workload, out will be nice yeah and let me ask some

315
00:28:11,682 --> 00:28:15,962
questions to the audience um who here is using dolphin,

316
00:28:18,102 --> 00:28:26,442
that of you that's good uh who here is using falcon or angelfish ah a few okay that's good.

317
00:28:30,882 --> 00:28:35,722
Camel or mackerel? Oh, I actually caught a bit of you. That's more than I expected.

318
00:28:39,082 --> 00:28:45,002
Caligra? Oh, there is a few. That's interesting.

319
00:28:49,142 --> 00:28:51,622
I mean, this presentation was done with caligra? her?

320
00:28:55,282 --> 00:29:02,362
Yeah. And who is using Plasma Mobile? Oh, well, that's more than expected.

321
00:29:05,682 --> 00:29:09,922
Yeah, I wish we would try to use our application more to dog food train,

322
00:29:10,142 --> 00:29:15,522
like, how can we convince our users to use these applications if,

323
00:29:15,562 --> 00:29:17,182
who says we are not using them?

324
00:29:18,062 --> 00:29:25,622
And, I mean, I'm Me doing my presentation with Kaliha, I found numerous bugs there.

325
00:29:26,542 --> 00:29:33,742
No crash, which is good. But still, numerous bugs, like the PDF export is not good,

326
00:29:35,862 --> 00:29:39,182
if you saw the exported PDF in the channel.

327
00:29:40,242 --> 00:29:46,602
But it's fixable. And if you try to use more other stuff, like,

328
00:29:46,682 --> 00:29:49,982
for example, Android, like there's There's a lot of KDE applications.

329
00:29:50,282 --> 00:29:54,682
You don't need to use PaaS Mobile to try to use these Android applications.

330
00:29:55,842 --> 00:30:01,982
It's really great. If you want to scan QR code, there's QRCR,

331
00:30:02,282 --> 00:30:05,462
which also do a lot of cool things there.

332
00:30:06,222 --> 00:30:11,762
And the more we use the application, we might be tempted to fix a few things

333
00:30:11,762 --> 00:30:14,222
and to improve them. And yeah.

334
00:30:17,110 --> 00:30:21,250
Yeah, and I mean, this thing, like, try to improve the KDE ecosystem is related

335
00:30:21,250 --> 00:30:26,070
to, basically, I saw the list of goals from the previous years,

336
00:30:26,230 --> 00:30:29,210
from three years, and it's basically related to all the goals.

337
00:30:30,890 --> 00:30:34,850
Even Wayland, like, having good support for Wayland in the application is also important.

338
00:30:38,590 --> 00:30:42,670
Consistency, accessibility, really,

339
00:30:42,770 --> 00:30:45,530
like, it's all, I mean, all the goals are related to make the

340
00:30:45,530 --> 00:30:50,190
application ecosystem of KDE better and yeah

341
00:30:50,190 --> 00:31:00,010
yeah that's it if you want to contact me these are my contact details um yeah

342
00:31:00,010 --> 00:31:05,670
and you can also talk with me um in academia or in class,

343
00:31:12,490 --> 00:31:16,430
Yes. Questions. We have questions.

344
00:31:19,570 --> 00:31:21,810
A lot of questions.

345
00:31:29,270 --> 00:31:34,690
You said about KDE applications and third-party applications.

346
00:31:34,790 --> 00:31:35,650
So if you want to use the third-party applications, you can use the third-party

347
00:31:35,650 --> 00:31:39,650
applications. If you make an application tightly related to KDE,

348
00:31:39,850 --> 00:31:45,050
what are the benefits to market as a third party and not as a KDE software compilation?

349
00:31:48,690 --> 00:31:54,550
That's a good question. I mean, originally we had the brand KDE Applications,

350
00:31:54,710 --> 00:31:56,470
which was used for the release.

351
00:31:57,550 --> 00:32:03,810
We tried to distance that a bit because it was not even all the applications,

352
00:32:04,530 --> 00:32:09,710
released by KDE, all of them were included in that release cycles thing.

353
00:32:10,130 --> 00:32:11,850
So we tried to distance that a bit.

354
00:32:12,550 --> 00:32:14,790
Um, yeah.

355
00:32:21,909 --> 00:32:25,989
I mean, if you are using KDE frameworks and not part of KDE.

356
00:32:26,289 --> 00:32:30,509
Yeah, so if I create an application that is very related to KDE,

357
00:32:30,669 --> 00:32:35,709
it's better to include it into KDE Suite instead of marking this,

358
00:32:35,809 --> 00:32:39,829
okay, it's a third-party application, we are not related to KDE.

359
00:32:40,429 --> 00:32:45,909
I mean, the thing with KDE applications is that there is a lot of requirements.

360
00:32:46,409 --> 00:32:54,749
You need to use all translation systems, You need to pass KDE review.

361
00:32:55,049 --> 00:32:57,589
There's a lot of requirements.

362
00:32:58,589 --> 00:33:03,169
And these requirements might not be for every application. I mean,

363
00:33:03,189 --> 00:33:06,109
even if you want to do a sort of dual licensing model,

364
00:33:08,729 --> 00:33:14,469
there's some really good reasons why you don't want to have applications as KDE applications,

365
00:33:14,729 --> 00:33:19,569
but still use KDE technologies, technologies and still be promoted to the KDE

366
00:33:19,569 --> 00:33:26,349
community as these applications works well with Plasma and that's something

367
00:33:26,349 --> 00:33:30,769
we try to promote these for the applications,

368
00:33:31,109 --> 00:33:35,149
not completely as a KDE applications, so we don't take too much responsibility

369
00:33:35,149 --> 00:33:37,969
for them, but see like their path.

370
00:33:40,895 --> 00:33:48,055
Hey Carl, so simple question, obviously you're into apps and you've created

371
00:33:48,055 --> 00:33:51,135
a butt-ton of them. When are you going to finish them all?

372
00:33:53,335 --> 00:33:58,895
Yeah, I'm quite good to start new applications. I'm a bit less good to finish them.

373
00:33:59,655 --> 00:34:06,535
I mean, as a state where I'm happy with applications and for ARIANA,

374
00:34:06,675 --> 00:34:11,875
for example, I think the application is mostly done, where it's just a project

375
00:34:11,875 --> 00:34:12,515
to change the rendering,

376
00:34:12,815 --> 00:34:17,035
but all the basic features are there. I'm happy with that.

377
00:34:17,395 --> 00:34:21,275
And then it doesn't need a lot of maintenance work just to keep it working,

378
00:34:21,575 --> 00:34:27,875
keep it putting away from the latest applications, maybe tweak a bit the UI,

379
00:34:28,435 --> 00:34:30,815
get some feedback for the users, fix the bugs.

380
00:34:30,995 --> 00:34:36,115
But at some point, there are some applications which are done.

381
00:34:36,115 --> 00:34:43,035
And like really i like to do those more applications which yeah yeah.

382
00:34:45,915 --> 00:34:49,475
Okay so um one thing

383
00:34:49,475 --> 00:34:58,895
i've seen in kdfs is that there are some applications emerging that that seems

384
00:34:58,895 --> 00:35:06,755
to do the similar things as already well-established app.

385
00:35:07,555 --> 00:35:11,135
I think one of the examples is Angelfish.

386
00:35:12,375 --> 00:35:16,375
I think we already have a web browser,

387
00:35:16,575 --> 00:35:23,555
Conqueror, and I really like the UI design of Conqueror and the functionalities

388
00:35:23,555 --> 00:35:29,095
of Conqueror is very rich, including a very important aspect,

389
00:35:29,255 --> 00:35:31,715
that is, it allows you to customize.

390
00:35:35,656 --> 00:35:39,076
My shortcuts um but you

391
00:35:39,076 --> 00:35:42,316
know there's angelfish which got started and it

392
00:35:42,316 --> 00:35:45,476
doesn't use k parts it doesn't allow

393
00:35:45,476 --> 00:35:48,856
you to customize shortcuts i feel that

394
00:35:48,856 --> 00:35:52,956
might you know i don't

395
00:35:52,956 --> 00:35:55,956
think it's a very good thing

396
00:35:55,956 --> 00:35:59,536
to like rewrite things from scratch that

397
00:35:59,536 --> 00:36:02,636
uh you know doesn't make use of

398
00:36:02,636 --> 00:36:05,936
existing knowledge and I feel

399
00:36:05,936 --> 00:36:10,176
you know the time and

400
00:36:10,176 --> 00:36:18,736
resources might be used to make say make concord better for like mobile users

401
00:36:18,736 --> 00:36:26,576
or etc yeah I mean I think that's part of my first idea with ecosystem you have

402
00:36:26,576 --> 00:36:28,376
some cooperation and competitions.

403
00:36:29,036 --> 00:36:33,336
And I think if you have a wide balance, it can be quite healthy for the ecosystem.

404
00:36:34,916 --> 00:36:42,496
I think a good example for that is Mercuro, which is like a KDE PIM representation in Qt Quick.

405
00:36:44,416 --> 00:36:48,496
But it's using, basically, all the libraries of the existing stuff.

406
00:36:48,756 --> 00:36:53,756
Like it's using ,, it's using to pass events.

407
00:36:54,796 --> 00:36:56,556
It's using all the ecosystem already.

408
00:36:58,056 --> 00:37:02,176
And having these two applications which compete a bit, like,

409
00:37:02,236 --> 00:37:08,576
I try to not market it as a competition, but it is a competition. I mean, it is what it is.

410
00:37:11,516 --> 00:37:15,436
But having Merkur in the ecosystem has improved a lot of Equality,

411
00:37:15,656 --> 00:37:19,316
which results in improvement to Camel and to Karganizer.

412
00:37:20,796 --> 00:37:28,196
And I think as long as you try to reuse components and to try to make them,

413
00:37:28,276 --> 00:37:31,376
it's fine to have competitions even inside the community.

414
00:37:34,836 --> 00:37:40,856
And for EngineFish, I mean, the reason why EngineFish exists is because of mobile.

415
00:37:41,036 --> 00:37:46,636
You cannot just conquer on mobile phone and you need a browser on your phone. So that's it.

416
00:37:50,176 --> 00:37:53,956
All right, testing, testing, one, two, three, okay.

417
00:37:54,436 --> 00:38:00,216
So I wanted to make a comment on one of the earlier slides and that is on how

418
00:38:00,216 --> 00:38:04,456
to get more contributions, more young blood into the projects.

419
00:38:06,036 --> 00:38:08,436
In QPrompt, I've had a.

420
00:38:10,657 --> 00:38:17,897
I haven't been able to, I can't expect people to go into the code and contribute

421
00:38:17,897 --> 00:38:23,497
very often because most of the people in the particular target audience,

422
00:38:23,617 --> 00:38:25,677
that community, they are not developers.

423
00:38:26,517 --> 00:38:34,337
So what I've done is put some web platforms that are very accessible.

424
00:38:34,337 --> 00:38:38,557
For example, in the translations website, I'm using WebLate,

425
00:38:38,697 --> 00:38:43,877
and with WebLate, it's integrating directly to K-internationalization,

426
00:38:44,157 --> 00:38:48,997
and all of the translations are done through there, and it's a great experience.

427
00:38:49,877 --> 00:38:55,197
And I think you could do the same, like look into how I did the setup with WebLate

428
00:38:55,197 --> 00:38:58,857
and copy it over, and feel free.

429
00:38:59,957 --> 00:39:02,677
And I've also done something similar for documentation. presentation there,

430
00:39:02,857 --> 00:39:10,617
it's a, I forgot its name, I think it's a, essentially people just write Markdown

431
00:39:10,617 --> 00:39:13,157
and they get a PDF. Works great.

432
00:39:14,417 --> 00:39:19,597
Yeah, I mean, I think we need more translators, like to reach more people with

433
00:39:19,597 --> 00:39:20,837
applications, we need more translators.

434
00:39:21,717 --> 00:39:25,537
I'm not happy with the QN workflow. I don't think anyone is really happy with that.

435
00:39:25,737 --> 00:39:30,297
It's just a lot of work and you need to be, try to be compatible with the QN1.

436
00:39:30,297 --> 00:39:33,857
One, the equation is a bit complicated, that's why I try to do like a sort of

437
00:39:33,857 --> 00:39:37,437
web thing based on the existing stuff.

438
00:39:38,777 --> 00:39:43,437
I mean, we need to discuss that at some point and I don't think there's a perfect solution.

439
00:39:43,717 --> 00:39:49,257
And yeah, but yeah, like if you want to get more users, we need to be available

440
00:39:49,257 --> 00:39:53,477
in more language and that needs more translators and you need to make the job

441
00:39:53,477 --> 00:39:55,637
for the translators as easy as possible.